Bytes Over Bagels · S1E27
Andy Crestodina, Web Strategist and Co-Founder at Orbit Media: transcript
A timestamped transcript with speaker turns separated acoustically from the original recording. Neutral speaker labels remain until individual names are editorially confirmed.
Speaker C
that's awesome. That was only nineteen?
Speaker B
Holy crap, it's August twenty fourth two thousand thirteen and you're listening to another episode of
Speaker B
Bites! Over!
Speaker B
Ooh, Brett's getting ripped.
Speaker D
Mmm.
Speaker E
Yay.
Speaker B
Oh, you know it, every day.
Speaker B
With me in the studio as per usual. One Miss Heather Brown.
Speaker E
Per usual.
Speaker B
Whoa.
Speaker E
I don't know what to say. Say what you're saying, girl.
Speaker B
One Mr. Brett Mackey. Pure muscle.
Speaker B
And everyone's favorite nemesis, Dave Seidler.
Speaker C
I'm so excited to read Don's next Facebook post.
Speaker B
I'm your host or M.C. or something John O'Sullivan. We have another great show for you on today's show with
Speaker C
Andy Cresto Dina.
Speaker B
Do-do-do-do-do-do.
Speaker F
Man,
Speaker C
King
Speaker F
that guy.
Speaker C
King of content, also known as the co-founder of Orbit Media Studios.
Speaker B
And that was just him talking Mandarin.
Speaker B
And Brett translating on the fly.
Speaker B
That's part of this interview, so stick around for it. We got a lot of show because there's a lot of interview, so let's get on to it.
Speaker B
The title of today's episode is Droppin' Logs and Writin' Blogs.
Speaker E
Today's bagels are brought to you by the one, the only New York City Bagel Deli and Catering. Get on over there, get your kettle baked goodness today,
Speaker C
You definitely
Speaker E
today,
Speaker C
have caffeine in
Speaker E
today.
Speaker C
the bloodstream. You are pumped up.
Speaker C
Head on over to bowtrust.com if you want to get some coffee in the bloodstream as well.
Speaker C
Check them out.
Speaker C
Tickle Phil's beard.
Speaker G
Is with Andy Crestodina. Did I say that right?
Speaker B
That's right, that's exactly right.
Speaker G
Nailed it. He is co-founder, Strategic Director of a little web design company here in Chicago called Orbit Media Studios.
Speaker C
Mm-hmm. If you don't know about Andy, he's been pretty much everywhere in the past year.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker C
You're a pretty popular guy.
Speaker B
I get around. I'm uh
Speaker C
Yeah, you do.
Speaker B
You're
Speaker G
Yeah,
Speaker B
a very you busy
Speaker G
I do.
Speaker B
guy. I say yes to things. I'm here.
Speaker G
Yeah, right.
Speaker B
That makes it everywhere.
Speaker C
Can you believe it?
Speaker G
I'm sure
Speaker G
I'm True.
Speaker H
right That's here.
Speaker G
true.
Speaker G
Yeah, right.
Speaker B
To be honest, he was creeping around downstairs scoping
Speaker G
That's
Speaker B
the place
Speaker G
right.
Speaker B
out. I think he
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker B
was about to bail out, but I saw him.
Speaker G
No, no. I mean, I've been parking outside this place for weeks waiting for the invite.
Speaker H
Yeah.
Speaker G
So glad to be here. Yeah,
Speaker B
That's
Speaker G
yeah,
Speaker B
awesome.
Speaker G
you're welcome. Yeah. We saw you and we picked up on the hint. So it's good that you
Speaker B
We
Speaker G
came.
Speaker B
got the letters.
Speaker G
Yeah, that's stuck in your podcasting.
Speaker G
Well,
Speaker G
all right. So those of us out there who don't know who you are, let's start.
Speaker G
start there.
Speaker G
Who are you?
Speaker C
Mm-hmm.
Speaker G
Who are you?
Speaker C
And what is Orbit?
Speaker G
And what is Orbit?
Speaker G
Uh, it's pretty straightforward.
Speaker G
I'm uh I grew up in the suburbs. I met a friend in high school,
Speaker G
Barrett Lombardo.
Speaker B
Barrett and I were pretty much uh huge goofballs through high school and college, went to college together, and um
Speaker G
What kind of goofballs?
Speaker B
slackers,
Speaker A
Ah yeah.
Speaker B
uh kind of low level criminals,
Speaker A
Ooh.
Speaker B
um just just trouble.
Speaker G
Yeah, let's go back
Speaker B
Awful student.
Speaker G
we'll go
Speaker B
Yeah, uh
Speaker G
we'll go back to the criminals of later.
Speaker B
Yeah, okay, we'll we'll we'll get to that.
Speaker G
Alright.
Speaker B
Um and uh so long story short, uh i i this was in the nineties and uh I'm old enough that there weren't classes for web design.
Speaker B
design for web development right 'cause I'm an old guy and uh and so basically right out of college uh he started doing web and I s was a goofball for a bit longer and
Speaker G
Mm-hmm.
Speaker B
eventually got a little more serious um
Speaker G
About crime?
Speaker B
yeah. Okay. Yeah, organised crime Okay. got us together. And and when that when that uh when that fell through then um started a web design company.
Speaker G
Sure. Smart.
Speaker B
Uh January of two thousand been doing web since then. It's been uh April s of two thousand one that we've been doing orbit.
Speaker B
And we make websites.
Speaker B
That's that's a easy way to say it, right? We're not a branding company, we're not an app development company, we're not like a web marketing company really um we're in Ravenswood. There's thirty three of us, we've got twelve developers, five designers, six project managers and uh it's still me and Barrett. And uh th we've got a uh the C_E_O_ we just keep going. So this is it, that's orbit. And uh so you say you don't do you don't do branding uh you do branding.
Speaker I
We don't do branding.
Speaker G
You don't do branding.
Speaker I
We don't do branding.
Speaker G
Don't do it at all, you just build websites.
Speaker I
We build websites. We do one thing.
Speaker G
With results, right?
Speaker I
We do. Yeah? We do. They're good sites.
Speaker G
Yeah, talk about the results, 'cause that's a huge part of your business, I think, and kinda sets you apart from a lot of other studios out there.
Speaker I
Yeah, it there's uh there's art and science in every web design project. Ours maybe have a bit more science than some. Uh we start the process by researching keywords.
Speaker I
In the end, really, clients are happy if the sites get results. And so to do that, the sites have to do two things. They've gotta get traffic, and they've gotta convert visitors into leads or convert visitors into customers.
Speaker I
So those two numbers, right? Your traffic and your conversion rates equals R_O_I_
Speaker G
Right.
Speaker I
So you have to begin with the end in mind and uh it w it's all built into this big process with uh you know everything's done in-house. But no, we the b the client has to come with the brand.
Speaker G
Okay.
Speaker I
Uh the client has to come with the con
Speaker I
with the content.
Speaker I
And once it's done, you know, we're project based, we're gonna hand that off and we're available to do any kind of marketing support. The client wants some advice, you know, we we put a lot of m information out there in our blog and in our events and stuff like that, like Dave was talking about, but really it's uh Orbit's just a web design company, so it's a pretty narrow focus. Within that we're pretty broad. Uh we work with tons of the Chicago brands, that's our favourite thing. We're we're not going anywhere,
Speaker I
we're we're just Chicago focused. Um
Speaker G
Love it.
Speaker I
Yeah, it's uh it's good. It's good, we kicked off Luma Latte's the other day.
Speaker C
Oh man
Speaker G
You gotta you love
Speaker C
beat us
Speaker G
that
Speaker C
to it.
Speaker G
you
Speaker C
I try
Speaker G
gotta
Speaker C
to reach out to those guys.
Speaker I
What are you gonna reach out to lose?
Speaker B
Mm-hmm.
Speaker C
I wanted to build we wanna build a m pizza app.
Speaker G
Yeah?
Speaker C
Well,
Speaker I
Well,
Speaker C
you work
Speaker I
you guess
Speaker C
work you
Speaker I
you
Speaker C
don't
Speaker I
can we're
Speaker C
do apps,
Speaker I
we're so doing well. no no, you can do the app. But,
Speaker G
Yeah,
Speaker I
but uh
Speaker G
well
Speaker I
we kicked off Luma Latte's.
Speaker G
You're doing mobile web you are doing mobile web.
Speaker I
Every site is responsive,
Speaker G
Okay,
Speaker C
And
Speaker G
yeah.
Speaker I
that's
Speaker C
I see.
Speaker I
the standard now,
Speaker G
Okay
Speaker I
uh even e-commerce.
Speaker C
Gotcha.
Speaker G
Uh w
Speaker C
Luma Latte's, that's huge.
Speaker I
It's huge, right? Uh the last one was Vienna beef, which is also huge. That's responsive e-commerce
Speaker I
of e-commerce which is fun
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker I
so
Speaker C
Cool.
Speaker I
this is what we're most proud of that's that's kind of why we exist it's it's to build the good stuff for the good people right here in town so that's
Speaker C
Cool.
Speaker I
our style
Speaker G
What's the recipe though? What's the secret? Tell us the secret recipe.
Speaker I
you know this is I don't know how how fun this is gonna sound but really it's about removing variables you want the key to success online is to just
Speaker I
You just take away every risk, anything that ever could go wrong. So example, like a lot of people like will outsource something. Well, if you don't outsource that, you know that, you know, that's not going to go wrong. So you have everybody in-house, you have everybody on-site, you use the same process, use the same tools,
Speaker I
use the same hosting, and that doesn't mean the sites are all the same, I mean it's a total
Speaker B
Sure.
Speaker I
different outcome for every client, but uh it's, you know, great uh successful web design really has to be based on a strong
Speaker I
wrong process that is totally focused on an outcome uh and you do that by removing every variable from the process. That's uh that's a huge part of it. As thrilling as that sounds, right? You hear
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
I am yeah. But that's that's really what it's about.
Speaker G
So um I wanna step back a minute because I'm just wondering how you even got here because you were
Speaker I
A misfit.
Speaker G
Misfit? Yeah, a misfit delinquent with uh what did you major? Major in like Chinese?
Speaker B
I majored in Chinese.
Speaker G
Mandarin or something.
Speaker B
Yep.
Speaker G
Yep.
Speaker I
Yep.
Speaker G
And and
Speaker C
That's awesome.
Speaker I
yep. Random.
Speaker G
yeah, random.
Speaker B
Give
Speaker G
Something
Speaker B
it give us a story before orbits like what were you doing
Speaker G
In
Speaker B
right
Speaker G
I want you
Speaker B
before
Speaker G
to s that? give us a story in Mandarin.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker G
In Mandarin.
Speaker I
Um, okay.
Speaker B
Um,
Speaker I
Um,
Speaker B
well,
Speaker B
zai da xue, yi shui de han yu.
Speaker A
You know, uh Dankjewel.
Speaker I
I was
Speaker A
I was sinds eenee meer oen.
Speaker I
I was only
Speaker B
Oh,
Speaker I
nineteen.
Speaker G
Okay.
Speaker B
that is awesome.
Speaker I
That's uh
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker I
I studied college and st college I studied Chinese and it's useless now as kind of Actually what I was just
Speaker B
with just one
Speaker I
starting
Speaker B
word,
Speaker I
to
Speaker B
it's
Speaker I
say.
Speaker B
like, okay.
Speaker I
Yeah.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker I
So that's not really um Can we put subtitles on this uh recording
Speaker B
Yeah, well that's
Speaker I
of this?
Speaker B
gonna be the title of the show, by the way. It is. We're cutting
Speaker G
You
Speaker B
that out.
Speaker G
should, you have
Speaker B
It is, it is.
Speaker I
put it in character Chinese characters will
Speaker I
Uh yeah, so that's so four years o four years of Mandarin went to went to China
Speaker I
uh uh loved it lived it there for a while came back um got a job as an i-t recruiter or a uh international recruiter it was supposed to be that fell through is just i-t recruiting so I was just like
Speaker G
Oh.
Speaker I
a straight up i-t recruiter can you imagine that can you imagine that job
Speaker G
Yuck.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker I
can you imagine that
Speaker G
You
Speaker I
job have no idea,
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker I
dave, what that would be like.
Speaker B
I sold
Speaker I
Yeah.
Speaker B
no
Speaker G
Copiers
Speaker B
clue.
Speaker G
out of college. That was my first job. So it's kind of worse.
Speaker I
You're starting somewhere.
Speaker G
It's starting somewhere.
Speaker I
People skills.
Speaker B
People's got it. People got to copy stuff.
Speaker G
People
Speaker I
Yeah.
Speaker G
do got to copy stuff.
Speaker G
Yeah, yeah, they do. So you were a good technical recruiter?
Speaker I
I got to the top of the firm.
Speaker G
Okay.
Speaker I
I mean, there were like six of us and I made it, you know, I became the, I mean as a tiny little place.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
But it was downtown.
Speaker I
It got me into the city. It got me out of my mom's basement.
Speaker G
Mm.
Speaker I
Because that's what I was doing then.
Speaker C
What suburb?
Speaker I
And Hoffman Estates, Illinois.
Speaker C
Nice, nice.
Speaker B
Mmm.
Speaker G
Mm.
Speaker C
Sexy.
Speaker I
I know, that's
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
like
Speaker I
It's like right there rolling meadows so close
Speaker B
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Speaker I
You talk about it. Yeah that I was that was living
Speaker B
Um
Speaker I
But we were making actually what really was happening was I was making interactive comic books
Speaker B
Ah!
Speaker C
Yeah,
Speaker I
Yeah
Speaker C
this is what I'm talking about.
Speaker I
Interactive comic books some claymation comic books pirate stories original
Speaker C
In soundtrack mom's basement.
Speaker I
in mom's basement.
Speaker C
Yep.
Speaker I
Yep. This is me. I'm working at Barnes & Noble
Speaker C
Yep.
Speaker I
She's
Speaker B
Um,
Speaker I
proud making
Speaker B
she's proud.
Speaker I
it. Yeah, she is
Speaker C
This is what we're talking about.
Speaker C
I want this
Speaker I
You
Speaker C
is this is the
Speaker I
want
Speaker C
dirt.
Speaker I
that?
Speaker C
This is the dirt.
Speaker I
Okay.
Speaker C
Yeah. Barnes and Noble.
Speaker I
Let's go back.
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker I
19…
Speaker C
What kind of car were you driving then?
Speaker I
An Oldsmobile stick shift. There was some old stick… it was called the Scorpion. It was a dark blue car bought from an ex-girlfriend in college.
Speaker C
Okay.
Speaker I
Yeah, so like let's say first half of 98,
Speaker I
living in mom's basement,
Speaker I
writing interactive clay pirate comic books in Caribou Coffee off of Higgins Road.
Speaker I
Road.
Speaker C
Described in detail.
Speaker I
And yeah, yeah, and and that was the dream, right, making papier mache pirate ships and sewing little pirate clothes to make uh interactive c pirate comic
Speaker G
Oh man.
Speaker I
called the tales of Captain Claybeard.
Speaker I
Which
Speaker G
Tell me these exist somewhere right
Speaker I
I
Speaker G
now.
Speaker I
never say this. I'll say it for you and your audience. It's OrbitComics.com.
Speaker G
Wow.
Speaker G
Wow.
Speaker I
There is
Speaker G
Our first breaking story.
Speaker I
it's been a long time. You will be the first visitors to that site in a long time
Speaker C
Let's
Speaker I
and it broke
Speaker C
revive
Speaker I
down.
Speaker C
this.
Speaker I
So somewhere on this probably like weird Flash website. I don't even know. I haven't looked at it myself in a long time.
Speaker I
There are I think a few pages of this interactive multiple choice.
Speaker I
original score claymation pirate story so
Speaker C
Nice. Was mom bringing you down like grilled cheese and
Speaker I
yeah
Speaker C
peanut butter and jelly sandwiches? No bread. No crust.
Speaker E
Mom, there's crust on this!
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
yeah
Speaker C
That's awesome.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker C
that's awesome.
Speaker I
uh that was it was fun but uh and I learned flash right it was I was totally obsessed with flash
Speaker C
Sure.
Speaker I
it was flash was all the rage it was like flash three and we were like
Speaker I
like hacking it to get it to, you know, use an embeddable movie clip to stay on a frame as a fake variable like
Speaker B
Ah.
Speaker I
we all kinds of weird things
Speaker C
Oh, we yeah.
Speaker I
did with it and um and and yeah, so those skills I guess rolled into the not the client and well, you know, I worked in restaurants and uh that that's where you learn client service and we did
Speaker B
True.
Speaker I
interactive comics and that's where I learned media and uh starting in January of two thousand that became you know, put those together, you got a web design company.
Speaker C
So what was your fir what was your first cli
Speaker C
Client when you decided
Speaker I
Oh,
Speaker C
okay
Speaker I
man.
Speaker C
an orbit is real.
Speaker I
Okay.
Speaker C
Like we're gonna do this
Speaker I
I got another breaking story for you because I never tell people this web address and I'm pitching them a new website right now but my first, the first website I ever did is still live.
Speaker I
It's like 600 pixels wide. It's orange and it's called tabledrapes.com. It's a website where you can order like, it's actually a great little business.
Speaker I
They make large format screen printing,
Speaker I
trade show table throws and table skirts.
Speaker I
Babel drapes taco now he's
Speaker G
I'm
Speaker I
talking
Speaker G
going right now.
Speaker I
that's it that's the first website ever worked on and that was the I was the designer and he was the programmer and that's
Speaker I
I mean
Speaker C
you know what we're
Speaker G
Wow,
Speaker C
not you
Speaker G
I feel so close to you right now looking at this, you know?
Speaker C
know you know we're almost not that far away with uh with the napkin app
Speaker G
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker I
That's uh that's a thirteen year old website that actually still
Speaker G
Still
Speaker I
gets
Speaker G
humming.
Speaker I
and it's still still producing ROI actually that's uh they're not unhappy with it to this day, but um no I'd rather I sh can we bleep that out? I don't want your I not ever wants to see that website.
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker G
Do you want that out
Speaker B
Maybe.
Speaker G
of there?
Speaker I
No, no, no, I'll leave it in.
Speaker G
No,
Speaker I
You want something
Speaker G
you want to leave
Speaker I
fancy?
Speaker G
it in? Alright.
Speaker I
They'll get some traffic from it, right?
Speaker G
Yeah,
Speaker I
There'll be
Speaker G
but some yeah, it's great for
Speaker C
You know what, we're going to
Speaker G
table
Speaker C
call drops. we'll we'll get them to sponsor the show.
Speaker G
Actually, this is the table we're sitting at right now might need a drape,
Speaker I
That's
Speaker G
so
Speaker I
right. That's
Speaker G
you know what?
Speaker I
right.
Speaker I
Table drapes suck. It ranks number one for table drapes. So look it up.
Speaker G
No doubt, what a strong
Speaker C
How much do
Speaker G
domain.
Speaker C
you have to pay for that web address?
Speaker C
tabledrapes.com. Is that what it is?
Speaker I
I don't know. Yeah, um I remember like we were in my second bedroom and we just like sketched out the logo
Speaker I
Oh, and I mean, it was super scrappy, like beginner kind of. It was like literally the two guys in the second bedroom trying
Speaker C
Right.
Speaker I
to make websites.
Speaker C
So you are, at least in most people's eyes, definitely mine, like a content god here.
Speaker C
And where,
Speaker I
Wow.
Speaker C
I mean, where did this come from? Like you're putting out amazing newsletters all the time.
Speaker I
Posts.
Speaker C
Gas
Speaker G
Blogs.
Speaker C
posts.
Speaker G
You can gas blog
Speaker C
You're
Speaker G
anything.
Speaker C
everywhere,
Speaker C
and every event that you speak at, I mean, people are coming away with really meaningful advice and stuff they can actually implement on their own. Where did this come from? Like, where
Speaker I
Dave, thank you.
Speaker C
I know,
Speaker I
Wow.
Speaker C
I know.
Speaker C
Wow,
Speaker C
I've been thinking about that for a long time.
Speaker I
It sounded great.
Speaker C
But you know what? You send out your, you send out your email blast at a perfect time, because I'm just getting ready to go in the shower,
Speaker C
and I read them right before.
Speaker C
I do.
Speaker I
That's good. That's that's the idea. They go with they go
Speaker B
They go with uh clean hygiene and it's part of the shower
Speaker C
Well,
Speaker G
Ah.
Speaker C
you know, I'm waiting for it to get hot and I just read it. I'm like, wow, that was great.
Speaker I
It's um
Speaker C
I'm going to get to work and do something.
Speaker I
You know, i hearing that just makes me step up and I got another I got another deadline for another newsletter. I have no idea what we're going to publish. So um yeah, pressures on. Thanks for that. Uh
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
come up with something
Speaker G
As
Speaker I
good.
Speaker G
you're writing,
Speaker I
Oh.
Speaker G
think of Dave stepping into
Speaker C
Well,
Speaker G
the bathroom.
Speaker C
w well actually, speaking of that, you
Speaker C
I've
Speaker B
that's
Speaker C
heard you talk before and you've given yeah, think of me in the bathroom.
Speaker G
Just about to de-robes.
Speaker A
Just beaming.
Speaker G
And
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker G
and fire up his iPhone.
Speaker B
Right.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker C
That's true.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker C
But I might be going to the bathroom too sometimes when I read it. But we can put that you can take that out.
Speaker G
Yeah. There we go, Dave.
Speaker B
No, that's gonna stay in.
Speaker C
Yeah, stay in. Well, yeah.
Speaker C
Um what the way you come up with the content for the blogs is actually interesting, the w the content that you use is actually
Speaker C
Mm on purpose because it's searchable content, correct?
Speaker I
Yeah, there's a there's a process for it, so let's say we could do one now. I mean you just you basically come up with a topic, right, like let's say
Speaker C
Showering.
Speaker I
how to I was gonna say how to promote a podcast, but we can
Speaker G
Okay.
Speaker I
focus on the bathroom if you'd like.
Speaker C
Yeah,
Speaker I
But
Speaker C
go
Speaker G
okay.
Speaker C
home and bathroom.
Speaker G
Okay.
Speaker I
Okay, so bathroom topics. Let's say that we choose something about showering, maybe it's something, I mean, it's got to be related to a business thing, right? These are school
Speaker G
Sure.
Speaker I
-oriented things, so
Speaker G
Sure.
Speaker I
whatever
Speaker B
Mm-hmm.
Speaker C
You could do this.
Speaker I
that might be, you know, shower caps, let's say. Okay, we're a shower cap business, and we're going to write a blog post today,
Speaker I
and so it's something about, something related to tips for the shower, hygiene, I don't know, foot fungus, flip-flops, whatever your topics are.
Speaker I
So you basically choose a topic then you align it with a key phrase.
Speaker C
Mm-hmm.
Speaker I
That's a huge huge part of my philosophy behind blogging, one of the big blogging has you know three main benefits. Search, social and email. If you don't align it with a key phrase, research key phrases, you know you're not gonna get the search benefit. And then you get traffic like that day or that week and then it kinda dies. No one's
Speaker C
Right.
Speaker I
gonna find our flip-flap article in n in two months if we didn't make it visible in search.
Speaker I
So a lot of what I do, like the last newsletter was about thank you pages.
Speaker G
I saw that.
Speaker G
Yep, Yeah,
Speaker I
there
Speaker G
it's you radical.
Speaker I
go. Yep. So it it it's uh it it ranks, right, because thank you it it start getting two phrases, thank you page examples,
Speaker G
Mm-hmm.
Speaker I
which is like two hundred and ninety people per month search for that. Okay. And thank you pages, nine thousand nine hundred people search for that every month. So
Speaker G
So you're researching the the key-word phrase for the topic of the blog before you actually write it, right?
Speaker I
Correct.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
Yep. Uh it's it's the it or during somewhere somewhere in that in that time I'm gonna
Speaker I
I'm gonna figure out like what people are searching for. So uh the idea is to make it uh high-quality and make it visible both through email, social, but but really search. And then it stays up there. And that that post will get traffic for months, for years sometimes. There's dozens of phrases, right, like probably half of the blog posts I've written are ranking on page one for something.
Speaker I
And then what happens is people find them, people find them useful and sometimes, you know, they'll they'll they'll find it and subscribe. You'll get you'll you know, if you do this long enough, you get subscribers every day.
Speaker I
Um and then some people will find it and blog a blog about that topic and link to it. If you do this long enough you'll get links every day. And basically that's how you slowly begin to dominate is by uh organically attracting links which help search, organically attracting subscribers which helps email, organically attracting I mean if you just put enough content out there, um you know everything just starts to get easier in life.
Speaker A
Hmm.
Speaker I
That's the philosophy.
Speaker G
You have a lot of good writers on staff actually. I just I read the
Speaker G
Chili con queso posts, I mean
Speaker B
Oh,
Speaker G
Who
Speaker B
that's
Speaker G
the hell doesn't love chili con queso? It was a great headline.
Speaker I
Uh,
Speaker G
And
Speaker I
she's a mega star and
Speaker G
yeah.
Speaker I
that's the first time she's written for us. That's Ginny Dietrich uh from Spin Sucks. You want to talk about an amazing blog uh do you guys any I don't know if you know Ginny a lot of she's a PR okay she's in she's in PR she has a PR firm she's been doing this uh a long time. She's a keynote speaker like A-lister like huge. Um and she is like in here.
Speaker I
In here in town. She's on the north side. She's not that far from me.
Speaker I
Anyway,
Speaker C
Of course.
Speaker I
dinsucks.com. Yeah, everyone's up there.
Speaker C
Everyone's
Speaker I
I don't know up why,
Speaker C
there.
Speaker I
yeah. Isn't it hard to attract talent down here and
Speaker C
Yeah,
Speaker I
recruit
Speaker C
yeah. Seriously.
Speaker I
in the hard downtown?
Speaker C
Never
Speaker I
to Yeah.
Speaker C
mind.
Speaker I
Yeah.
Speaker C
I'm gonna switch
Speaker I
I don't know what
Speaker C
off that
Speaker I
you question. guys do down here.
Speaker C
Where
Speaker I
Yeah.
Speaker C
are we even?
Speaker I
I know, I
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker I
don't know what
Speaker C
We came
Speaker I
this neighborhood
Speaker C
in and he's is like,
Speaker I
is.
Speaker C
where what is this place?
Speaker I
Yeah, right.
Speaker C
I know.
Speaker I
I was like,
Speaker B
What are those big buildings over there? It's super strange.
Speaker I
I don't recognize those. I'm like, I'm south of Addison right now. Where am I? I'm lost.
Speaker I
Uh but Jenny has a has a has a blog.
Speaker I
has a blog called spin sucks and a bad post will get fifty comments. She's a community building genius. There are
Speaker G
Fifty comments for a bad post, that's
Speaker I
yeah,
Speaker G
amazing.
Speaker I
a lot
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
of them clear a hundred, and there's two a day.
Speaker G
Oh, whoa.
Speaker I
And it is the most engaged community I have ever seen in a website by a lot. Um
Speaker C
And that's awesome.
Speaker I
and it's super fun. Like if you wanna and that and uh there's an example of of how guest blogging has not just search but social benefits.
Speaker I
It's you write a fun post for spin sucks and you will just it just lights on fire and your next day and a half you're gonna be responding to comments, you know Getting a ton of followers and just chatting with new people online making friends
Speaker I
that's a
Speaker I
She's she's someone to watch and learn from and we're honored to have Jenny on our on our blog today Jenny Dietrich
Speaker C
So somewhere along the way you f you realize you know a little bit something about content and
Speaker C
and building websites and then you got cocky and you made a you decided to make a book.
Speaker G
Yeah. Went overboard. Just pushed my luck on that
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker G
one. And um yeah,
Speaker G
it's uh y i mean
Speaker C
Uh, you didn't make the book, well maybe you did make the
Speaker G
Yeah,
Speaker C
book.
Speaker G
maybe you went back to your mom's basement.
Speaker C
And you made
Speaker G
Right,
Speaker C
the you book.
Speaker G
got
Speaker I
Yep.
Speaker G
all the materials
Speaker C
You wrote
Speaker G
together.
Speaker C
a book,
Speaker G
It's
Speaker C
you paper wrote a
Speaker G
mache,
Speaker C
book.
Speaker G
it's cl it's
Speaker C
I eat crusts!
Speaker G
yeah.
Speaker G
Yeah, it's uh it they I got out the sewing kit and the paper mache.
Speaker I
made some clay and I made the book just like Claybeard in style. No, it's a
Speaker C
So what is this book? Tell us about it.
Speaker I
okay. Uh content is so if I I say it this way sometimes, if Orbit was if Orbit built cars, I'd be a drivers ed teacher. The idea is that, you know, building a website is not enough. You have to m have activity behind it to get results. Um you have website if you don't have a a pulse or if you're not publishing anything, your website is a brochure. And that's totally fine, but uh the real prize goes to people
Speaker G
to people that can actually uh produce content and and you know give their website kind of give people a reason to come back, give search engines a reason to rank it. So that's what the book's about it's it's um I wrote a blog post that explained uh how you can blog with intent and blog with an ended mind, and then I decided to take my own advice and turn and gradually um blog my way into a book kind of uh there's five or six posts that were repurposed into the book and then another
Speaker I
100 pages of other advice that I knew that I
Speaker C
Uh-oh.
Speaker I
had in me and so it's called content chemistry. If you search for it you can find it, it's on Amazon,
Speaker C
I'm sure you
Speaker I
yeah,
Speaker C
can.
Speaker I
you can find it pretty easily.
Speaker B
Ha ha ha.
Speaker I
Um and uh th it's the it's not I'm not trying to really like be an author, it's just an example of how you can go bigger with content. Uh it's uh it's really just a te it's like a textbook almost, it's a handbook, it's n you it's full of charts, there's like fifty different diagrams or something.
Speaker I
Um but it's uh it's really just an example of uh of of more marketing. You know I think we've s total right now we're about six grand in the whole on it, because
Speaker G
Okay.
Speaker I
I give it away for free all the time. Uh drop it from helicopters is
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker I
really the marketing plan. Right.
Speaker B
Yeah, I d you didn't bring any
Speaker I
I brought one for you.
Speaker E
Hey.
Speaker G
Hey, where's the bell?
Speaker B
Oh yeah.
Speaker G
I wanna ring the bell.
Speaker C
Yeah, there's no bell. Always bring it, he's busting it out right now.
Speaker G
Oh man.
Speaker C
No one knows what I just meant by that, but yeah, he's getting the book out.
Speaker G
No way. It's
Speaker B
Oh.
Speaker G
our first gift, our first breaking
Speaker C
Thank you.
Speaker G
story, our Oh, first gift.
Speaker C
we'll take it, we'll take it. Wait, let's get a picture of Andy holding this right now.
Speaker G
Oh oh yeah, let's do that.
Speaker C
And we gotta get signed. No, we're gonna get a picture of you signing this book.
Speaker G
I don't know that that's gonna really uh
Speaker C
That's gonna devalue it?
Speaker I
Okay.
Speaker C
Well, it's
Speaker I
This
Speaker C
good. one is for you. For the bath f for Dave. Right, and th and for Dave in his shower.
Speaker G
Oh man.
Speaker I
For Dave.
Speaker A
With love. Oh, man.
Speaker B
I like
Speaker A
And
Speaker B
that.
Speaker A
towels.
Speaker B
Towels. Sometimes.
Speaker A
Yeah,
Speaker B
Nice.
Speaker A
here you go.
Speaker B
I'm in the neighborhood if you ever want to swing by.
Speaker A
No, no. Oh, oh, that would be great. You know what? You know what I want to set up, Andy?
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
Dave's birthday is actually coming
Speaker B
Tomorrow.
Speaker A
up.
Speaker A
I
Speaker B
What?
Speaker A
want you. Could you just go over there?
Speaker A
Right before shower time, maybe he's in the shower, you're sitting on the pot at steaming, nothing,
Speaker A
you can't see anything.
Speaker A
Could you just read him?
Speaker A
Read
Speaker B
them read
Speaker A
that
Speaker B
the morning
Speaker A
morning or I chose.
Speaker B
the post i
Speaker A
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B
would love that when a practice opened
Speaker A
That's my gift to you, Dave.
Speaker B
Yeah,
Speaker A
That sounds
Speaker B
just read
Speaker A
good.
Speaker B
me a chapter every week
Speaker B
You got it. That's uh, okay, we're gonna talk about compelling calls to action right I would you know what I'd much rather I do it like Princess Bride style where he's in the bed with me like like
Speaker A
Oh,
Speaker B
the grandpa's
Speaker A
like the grandpa.
Speaker B
in bed with Fred Savage
Speaker A
Right.
Speaker B
And then I get like freaked out and it goes back to the scene and it's like no I don't want to I don't want to hear about them kissing he's like okay then we're done
Speaker B
But
Speaker A
No.
Speaker B
we're done, Grandpa. You know, we're done. We're done.
Speaker B
Do you want me to go?
Speaker A
No.
Speaker B
Okay,
Speaker B
keep reading.
Speaker B
And then at the end,
Speaker A
Oh. Yeah.
Speaker B
Andy leaves.
Speaker A
Oh.
Speaker B
And I say, Andy.
Speaker A
Will you come back
Speaker B
Will you come
Speaker A
and make
Speaker B
back tomorrow
Speaker A
some more? Yeah.
Speaker B
and read it again?
Speaker C
Oh, this is this is
Speaker A
a blog post. That's the next newsletter right there.
Speaker B
Who isn't searching for princess
Speaker C
I don't
Speaker B
brides
Speaker C
think I was constantly? gonna be the first person
Speaker A
The Fred Savage
Speaker C
to try the
Speaker A
guy.
Speaker C
show.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker C
But I am really
Speaker B
You're tearing up.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker B
You're tearing
Speaker A
I am
Speaker B
up a little bit.
Speaker C
yeah.
Speaker A
Oh
Speaker B
Wow, this really got derailed. I don't know what happened.
Speaker A
But Fred Savage
Speaker C
That wasn't
Speaker A
reference.
Speaker C
real.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
It's bringing me back.
Speaker C
Yeah,
Speaker B
Isn't
Speaker C
everybody
Speaker B
so good?
Speaker C
loves Fred Savage.
Speaker B
Oh, I just saw it the other day.
Speaker B
Dang, wow.
Speaker A
I like
Speaker B
Did
Speaker A
it.
Speaker B
you almost not follow through with Orbit?
Speaker B
Like, was there a time where you were really struggling and you were like,
Speaker B
maybe I'm not going to do this?
Speaker A
Oh man,
Speaker A
I haven't written this, but I thought about writing the post where I should actually scan my social security statement.
Speaker A
I made $5,000 in 2000 and $7,000 in 2001.
Speaker A
And uh then then I went back down to five thousand dollars in two thousand two,
Speaker D
Mm.
Speaker A
because the economy sucked, we had no clients, and we just scraped by.
Speaker B
Yeah, I what was your
Speaker A
I almost
Speaker B
life like
Speaker A
died.
Speaker B
then? I mean a lot of people are starting startups and companies and
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker B
there's lonely times and there's times you're failing a lot.
Speaker A
Yep.
Speaker B
What advice do you have? I mean
Speaker B
based on your own experience.
Speaker A
Well, answer the question why.
Speaker A
Know why you're doing what you're doing. Right? If you love what you're doing, if you believe in the concept and if you are totally dedicated to the model,
Speaker A
it really doesn't matter.
Speaker A
Nothing will stop you anyway.
Speaker A
So you can do a lot of introspection and I think people should doubt themselves,
Speaker A
but don't do it every day. Maybe set a time, you know, okay, I'm going to review my concept every quarter.
Speaker A
Between now and then I'm not going to think about it, right? I'm not going to complain or doubt myself every time.
Speaker B
Mm-hmm.
Speaker A
Um but once you're once you're in it, right if you know why you're doing it and if you have purpose and you believe in the concept and you're totally dedicated to uh to your startup, whatever it is, um you are i this is going to sound insane. You're just not going to fail.
Speaker A
You're going to adapt it. You're going to change it. You're going to put in more sweat,
Speaker A
right?
Speaker A
I had the Calvin Coolidge quote framed in my office.
Speaker A
Do you know this one?
Speaker A
Press on.
Speaker A
No, persistence alone is omnipotent.
Speaker C
Nice.
Speaker A
If you do not give up, you do not fail. They're basically the same thing, right? So so if you're just totally focused, if you're as obsessed and single minded and just crazy about what you're doing as I was back then and still am,
Speaker A
you're invincible.
Speaker A
Nothing will beat you. I mean, your competitors will they'll wonder how you did it because you worked harder, smarter,
Speaker A
longer and you stayed focused on that one thing for longer than anybody else.
Speaker A
us uh and so those like a tree right, those roots are deeper and that trunk is stronger. You basically are going to become uber relevant in your field uh no matter what eventually.
Speaker B
That's awesome. So when you went back down to five thousand,
Speaker B
Were you like, that's it,
Speaker B
I gotta get a real job. Like, I gotta like, I gotta work it.
Speaker A
I had to keep I did have to keep it real of course so I took teaching gigs because I was I got certified to teach and I was I was a teacher of English in China and I went back and I started teaching English at DePaul to these groups of Chinese students just a little bit on the side.
Speaker A
But yeah, I um I was be I b I burned through the whole 401k that I had as a recruiter, all my savings. Uh my partner racked up a credit card. Um and we just uh we were just totally determined. So uh I don't
Speaker B
What
Speaker A
think
Speaker B
what
Speaker A
we really consider, we didn't really even consider quitting. I don't that that
Speaker B
like what got you over the hump?
Speaker B
When were you like okay, w this is now where we figured this out.
Speaker A
Right. Uh there's a a million little victories you've gotta celebrate along the way. So what does uh what your reason why, you know you should be both finding the answer to that all the time. So for us it was a lot of the clients results, it was a lot of the feedback we were getting on the work we did, uh it was the occasion you know the referral here and there and just people telling us that we were doing good work for them. Um
Speaker A
You know, you're you're working for dirt and compliments, so enjoy those compliments.
Speaker B
Sure.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker B
You're just getting free pizza now from Luminati's. That's it. That's
Speaker A
Yeah,
Speaker B
how you're right. paid, right?
Speaker A
I am so thrilled to be working. It's it and that's
Speaker B
That's an aw
Speaker A
that's a payoff right? I mean it to do a website for Lou Malnati's
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
like I have I I'm
Speaker B
Pretty awesome.
Speaker A
we're built on that stuff, right? You are what you eat. I mean, I'm like a third
Speaker B
I ate
Speaker A
Lou Malnati.
Speaker B
I ate it today for lunch.
Speaker A
Did
Speaker B
I'm not even you lying.
Speaker A
really?
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
I believe it. Yeah, it's the best
Speaker B
With
Speaker A
out
Speaker B
the there. sausage patty.
Speaker A
Oh yeah,
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
the sausage lose, I mean how else do It you get,
Speaker B
can't be that.
Speaker A
no, it's irresistible.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
And that's a huge, huge honour for us, you know, Vienna beef,
Speaker B
I
Speaker A
American Charter Bank, Luma Nadies, Linkin Park Zoo, all of the these are why we exist. Uh I love these companies and I'm so grateful for all the clients that have made this possible, that's why we're in business. Um, you know, take care of the people you work for and work with and
Speaker A
and uh everything will work out somehow in the end.
Speaker E
Cool.
Speaker C
Well, I think it's time. I think it
Speaker A
is.
Speaker C
I think
Speaker A
I think
Speaker C
it's it is. time. I think it's time. You know it's coming because you're
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker C
one of the few guests who've listened to a few of the shows.
Speaker A
I think I do know what's coming.
Speaker C
Do you?
Speaker A
And I pre I'm prepared for this.
Speaker C
Are you?
Speaker A
I think so.
Speaker C
Do you want to ask yourself the question?
Speaker B
Um, if I know what you're gonna ask, it's uh it's about um um a b bread preference,
Speaker C
Uh-huh, uh-huh.
Speaker B
and it's about uh specifically bagels and what kind
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker B
of bagel.
Speaker A
What
Speaker C
Yeah, yeah. The question is
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker C
what is your favourite bagel, and how do you like it prepared?
Speaker B
Okay.
Speaker A
I know that the they I I was I knew you'd ask and I'm gonna answer differently than I think all your other guests have asked
Speaker C
Oh boy.
Speaker A
um I am going to choose the bagel dog
Speaker C
Whaaat?
Speaker A
I know man I could eat those every day I would eat them every day
Speaker C
Yeah!
Speaker B
That's awesome.
Speaker A
so
Speaker C
Yeah!
Speaker A
I
Speaker B
From
Speaker A
would get
Speaker B
where?
Speaker A
well
Speaker A
I mean if you're gonna get them you you can get them at home and uh vianabeef.com you can order like
Speaker B
Oh,
Speaker A
a five
Speaker B
I knew he
Speaker A
pound
Speaker B
was going
Speaker A
box
Speaker B
here.
Speaker A
of beggar
Speaker B
I knew he was going
Speaker A
dogs,
Speaker C
Look at this guy.
Speaker B
here.
Speaker A
but that's
Speaker C
I can't
Speaker A
not my v that's not my answer. It's
Speaker B
Okay.
Speaker A
the it's Einstein's
Speaker B
Okay.
Speaker C
Okay.
Speaker A
uh
Speaker C
They got
Speaker A
and
Speaker C
it nice.
Speaker A
and you get the Asiago bagel dog which they're out of like half the time. They don't care at that place.
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker A
They don't have the love. Yeah.
Speaker C
Right.
Speaker A
But if you get the af the Asiago bagel dog right and you get it without the meal because you don't want those weird like chips or that
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
potato salad's not very good.
Speaker A
good
Speaker C
Oh, you yeah.
Speaker A
get it solo and
Speaker B
Okay.
Speaker A
then the mustard packets are just the crappy yellow mustard so ask
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker A
them they keep the good spicy mustard
Speaker C
No behind joke.
Speaker A
there yeah
Speaker B
Mm-hmm.
Speaker A
so ask them for the good mustard
Speaker C
because Don't
Speaker A
they've got
Speaker C
love
Speaker A
it yeah
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
so the asiago bagel dog with the spicy mustard the secret behind the counter mustard and uh and
Speaker B
That's awesome.
Speaker A
and that's you know i could eat two three of those easy
Speaker B
Wow.
Speaker C
Man.
Speaker B
That's
Speaker C
Man,
Speaker B
a great it's answer.
Speaker C
so
Speaker B
I don't
Speaker C
good.
Speaker B
even know what are you doing? You didn't talk about any exercise regimen. You're eating chocolate croissant in the morning.
Speaker B
You're
Speaker A
No.
Speaker B
eating three bagel dogs every day.
Speaker A
You're not
Speaker B
And
Speaker A
over,
Speaker B
you're
Speaker A
you're not,
Speaker B
out of
Speaker A
you're
Speaker B
work
Speaker A
not overweight.
Speaker B
totally. You're not over 160,
Speaker C
Look at this guy.
Speaker B
four pounds.
Speaker C
Look at this guy. He's walking
Speaker A
No,
Speaker C
catwalks.
Speaker A
I'm underweight. I'm way underweight because I eat, I just don't, I'm lazy about food.
Speaker A
I'm really bad at eating and I just don't like to, I just, food's a pain in the ass.
Speaker A
If there was a...
Speaker A
Uh a place to get those bagel dogs near me. I would probably weigh
Speaker B
Are
Speaker A
like two hundred pounds, but
Speaker B
Are you working out? Do you work
Speaker A
No,
Speaker B
out? Are you
Speaker A
I running? never work out. No, you run.
Speaker C
Yeah.
Speaker B
How do you know that?
Speaker A
I know you run. I Look seen
Speaker C
at
Speaker A
you
Speaker C
this,
Speaker A
run.
Speaker C
like,
Speaker B
Really? You've seen me?
Speaker C
he is a creeper.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker B
That's awesome.
Speaker A
He is a
Speaker B
That's
Speaker A
total creeper.
Speaker B
really weird.
Speaker C
No, I've talked to you when I've s I don't know how I knew that.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker B
I don't know, but that's weird. But But it's Brett's Brett's known a lot of stuff about you that you didn't know either.
Speaker C
Yeah yeah. Well he's doing his job, I
Speaker A
That's
Speaker C
guess.
Speaker A
true.
Speaker C
I guess.
Speaker A
Me, I'm just a stalker.
Speaker B
Maybe that is your job.
Speaker C
No, but I knew you
Speaker B
Who are you from some I've seen you run. Uh I don't know
Speaker C
Maybe,
Speaker B
where.
Speaker C
maybe we
Speaker B
You
Speaker C
run.
Speaker B
ran by you came into the bar when you were after running or something maybe.
Speaker A
I don't know.
Speaker B
Alright. That's it.
Speaker C
Thanks for coming in.
Speaker B
Loved
Speaker A
Hey Andy,
Speaker B
it.
Speaker C
Awesome.
Speaker B
It
Speaker A
it was
Speaker B
was a great
Speaker A
a good meeting
Speaker B
interview.
Speaker A
you.
Speaker B
Guys, honor,
Speaker C
That was
Speaker B
you
Speaker C
perfect.
Speaker B
done it for me. And uh I'm
Speaker A
Us too.
Speaker B
psyched we're gonna collaborate, right?
Speaker A
Yep, we're gonna
Speaker C
Yeah,
Speaker A
do it.
Speaker C
we're doing something
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker C
awesome.
Speaker A
Yeah.
Speaker C
Stay tuned,
Speaker A
Wine
Speaker C
people.
Speaker A
and bagels.
Speaker B
Yeah, it's
Speaker C
Yeah,
Speaker B
coming
Speaker C
wine
Speaker B
up.
Speaker C
and bagels.
Speaker B
Brace yourselves.
Speaker A
Yes.
Speaker B
We're out.
Speaker B
The show's adult beverages are sponsored by Cobalt Distillery, that's cobalt-distillery.com. They're here in Chicago,
Speaker B
check them out. Fine spirits, they got organic ryes, bourbons, a whole slew of other spirits. And you should check them out on Instagram actually.
Speaker B
Right now they got a bunch of photos of bottles of liquor in front of huge aquariums of manta rays.
Speaker F
Mm-hmm.
Speaker B
and such. I don't know what they're doing, but it's kind of interesting.
Speaker A
Xanther rays.
Speaker B
Yeah. Yeah. So I got
Speaker F
Let's
Speaker B
like,
Speaker F
go to the
Speaker B
they
Speaker F
next
Speaker B
just are,
Speaker F
level.
Speaker B
they're just putting bottles in front of these huge aquariums at some uh
Speaker A
It's gotta be the shed.
Speaker B
it's not the shed actually, they're on location somewhere.
Speaker F
Hmm.
Speaker B
Just feeding
Speaker A
Oh.
Speaker F
Maui.
Speaker B
feeding uh dolphins booze.
Speaker A
Oh no, dolphins love booze.
Speaker B
They do, I'll tell you what.
Speaker F
Let's go
Speaker B
Filling in the gaps this week is Chicago's
Speaker C
I
Speaker B
the
Speaker C
don't
Speaker B
Baryones,
Speaker C
wanna see
Speaker B
the Nether Friends,
Speaker B
check them out at netherfriends
Speaker C
care
Speaker B
.us,
Speaker C
and I don't wanna
Speaker B
or butts or bagels.com.
Speaker C
And that concludes episode 27 of Bites!
Speaker C
Whoa.
Speaker A
Oh. Join join us next week on the show where we'll have
Speaker B
I
Speaker A
Ravi Bhat
Speaker B
I'm beating time and we'll never
Speaker A
co-founder
Speaker B
get older
Speaker C
and CEO of
Speaker B
We never grow new to it
Speaker C
branch fire and I annotate. That's pretty exciting. Yeah.
Speaker B
Let's make
Speaker C
I like this.
Speaker B
it last
Speaker C
It's it's pimp. It may be the future.
Speaker B
Just
Speaker C
As
Speaker B
call it
Speaker C
always you can find us on Twitter, you can find us on Facebook, you can find us on Instagram. There are other social media outlets that I use that no one else does that you can find us on.
Speaker C
And you can subscribe in a couple of ways. One is our newsletter where we'll let you know when a new episode is posted and who's on the show, along with the good old-fashioned iTunes podcast.
Speaker A
Oh, he's still giving away free coffee?
Speaker B
Yeah, we're still giving away free coffee everyone.
Speaker A
Ooh.
Speaker G
Yeah.
Speaker B
So you sign up for that newsletter, you're gonna get a free cup of coffee from Bodros.
Speaker G
It's a pretty good deal, considering we really don't spam you.
Speaker A
That's right.
Speaker G
It's a pretty good deal. Or better yet,
Speaker B
How many unsubscribe's have we had?
Speaker G
uh I don't know if we've had any.
Speaker B
Okay, thanks guys.
Speaker G
Yeah, that was actually pretty legit of you guys. It's gone up every week.
Speaker G
That concludes today's episode. We'll see you next week.
Speaker B
Aren't we special.